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	<title>Comments for Folknology</title>
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	<link>http://blog.folknology.com</link>
	<description>Techno group therapy</description>
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		<title>Comment on Open Hardware Production by OSH a way forward Pt.3 &#8211; XCore &#38; Amino Fusion &#171; Folknology Labs</title>
		<link>http://blog.folknology.com/2009/08/11/open-hardware-production/#comment-77</link>
		<dc:creator>OSH a way forward Pt.3 &#8211; XCore &#38; Amino Fusion &#171; Folknology Labs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Jan 2010 21:31:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.folknology.com/?p=65#comment-77</guid>
		<description>[...] may also be useful to refer to the historical framing of this from the Open Hardware Production [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] may also be useful to refer to the historical framing of this from the Open Hardware Production [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on Open Hardware Production by OSH a way forward &#8211; Part 2 OpenSoftChip &#171; Folknology Labs</title>
		<link>http://blog.folknology.com/2009/08/11/open-hardware-production/#comment-76</link>
		<dc:creator>OSH a way forward &#8211; Part 2 OpenSoftChip &#171; Folknology Labs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Jan 2010 22:32:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.folknology.com/?p=65#comment-76</guid>
		<description>[...] explain where we are coming from with regard to moving OpenSource Hardware (OSH) forward, also see Open Hardware Production for a historical background/context. Obviously many folks working on many projects are all [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] explain where we are coming from with regard to moving OpenSource Hardware (OSH) forward, also see Open Hardware Production for a historical background/context. Obviously many folks working on many projects are all [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on Open Hardware Production by Andrew Back</title>
		<link>http://blog.folknology.com/2009/08/11/open-hardware-production/#comment-75</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Back</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Dec 2009 12:45:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.folknology.com/?p=65#comment-75</guid>
		<description>@Bob Not true regarding Bug Labs and hardware specs. I got the GPLed schematics and CAD files etc from them around a year ago. There were licensing errors on the CAD files as they stated they were proprietary property of some design company or other, but when I notified them they changed the meta-data.

The Bug platform is rather expensive and you have a point regarding third parties making cheaper clones. However, I that believe that with open hardware, just as with F/OSS, there is an opportunity to leverage the &#039;because effect&#039;, and to make money *because*  hardware exists rather than just simply from its sale. Gain market share by striving to offer best service, to be most knowledgeable and to offer the latest innovation etc, as well as working on manufacturing costs. And again, as with F/OSS, work to create a community, to position your solution as a platform and thus to foster an ecosystem, thereby sharing development costs and leading to sustainability. Look at Arduino for example. There are third party, licensed versions bearing the name and many clones, with the originators seemingly doing fine out of it all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Bob Not true regarding Bug Labs and hardware specs. I got the GPLed schematics and CAD files etc from them around a year ago. There were licensing errors on the CAD files as they stated they were proprietary property of some design company or other, but when I notified them they changed the meta-data.</p>
<p>The Bug platform is rather expensive and you have a point regarding third parties making cheaper clones. However, I that believe that with open hardware, just as with F/OSS, there is an opportunity to leverage the &#8216;because effect&#8217;, and to make money *because*  hardware exists rather than just simply from its sale. Gain market share by striving to offer best service, to be most knowledgeable and to offer the latest innovation etc, as well as working on manufacturing costs. And again, as with F/OSS, work to create a community, to position your solution as a platform and thus to foster an ecosystem, thereby sharing development costs and leading to sustainability. Look at Arduino for example. There are third party, licensed versions bearing the name and many clones, with the originators seemingly doing fine out of it all.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Open Hardware Production by folknology</title>
		<link>http://blog.folknology.com/2009/08/11/open-hardware-production/#comment-68</link>
		<dc:creator>folknology</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Oct 2009 21:46:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.folknology.com/?p=65#comment-68</guid>
		<description>Thanks bob

Definitely agree on some of those points:

Power consumption is often an important consideration and modularisation can sacrifice efficiency in some cases, I guess the question is how far does one take the modularisation. Simularly in Opensource software modularisation can have efficiency disadvantages (code size/optimisation etc..) but it does help enable more rapid development and more co-operative innovation. It can also reduce reinvention overheads, lowering overall developments costs, and often increases reliability. Some of these other benefits can cross into the opensource hardware space, but like all changes there are pros and cons. There can also be indirect benefits such as knowledge transfer of efficiencies that perhaps a newbie would not be able to implement on their own, this could result in a lower power solution for example, so it&#039;s not black and white.

I agree with consumer applications, although the volumes I am referring to here are certainly sub consumer volumes. High enough to benefit from scale but perhaps not mass production - more like cottage production.

The OSH project sounds interesting do you have any links?

PC/104 was overkill for the sort of applications we were considering.

Yup I have seen Buglabs which is very interesting but also high cost.

I was purposely avoiding business models as am pursuing this outside of those interests. However I do believe in the &quot;Because effect&quot; among other Opensource benefits. I also don&#039;t see much money in hardware manufacture unless you are gunning for consumer volumes so I rule that out straightaway, I am personally looking to get Hardware produced by anyone in the community as low cost as possible. Thus if someone can make stuff cheaper then that is good it means our designs/idea go further and benefit more folks and deliver even more value.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks bob</p>
<p>Definitely agree on some of those points:</p>
<p>Power consumption is often an important consideration and modularisation can sacrifice efficiency in some cases, I guess the question is how far does one take the modularisation. Simularly in Opensource software modularisation can have efficiency disadvantages (code size/optimisation etc..) but it does help enable more rapid development and more co-operative innovation. It can also reduce reinvention overheads, lowering overall developments costs, and often increases reliability. Some of these other benefits can cross into the opensource hardware space, but like all changes there are pros and cons. There can also be indirect benefits such as knowledge transfer of efficiencies that perhaps a newbie would not be able to implement on their own, this could result in a lower power solution for example, so it&#8217;s not black and white.</p>
<p>I agree with consumer applications, although the volumes I am referring to here are certainly sub consumer volumes. High enough to benefit from scale but perhaps not mass production &#8211; more like cottage production.</p>
<p>The OSH project sounds interesting do you have any links?</p>
<p>PC/104 was overkill for the sort of applications we were considering.</p>
<p>Yup I have seen Buglabs which is very interesting but also high cost.</p>
<p>I was purposely avoiding business models as am pursuing this outside of those interests. However I do believe in the &#8220;Because effect&#8221; among other Opensource benefits. I also don&#8217;t see much money in hardware manufacture unless you are gunning for consumer volumes so I rule that out straightaway, I am personally looking to get Hardware produced by anyone in the community as low cost as possible. Thus if someone can make stuff cheaper then that is good it means our designs/idea go further and benefit more folks and deliver even more value.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Open Hardware Production by Bob Cousins</title>
		<link>http://blog.folknology.com/2009/08/11/open-hardware-production/#comment-67</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob Cousins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Sep 2009 06:50:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.folknology.com/?p=65#comment-67</guid>
		<description>If you are looking for open source modules suitable for consumers try http://www.buglabs.net/ However, it&#039;s nowhere near cheap, and the hardware is not very open, since they have been going 2 years but are very reluctant to publish any hardware specs.

You also have to look at the business model, if the hardware can be easily manufactured cheaper by third parties, where is the revenue stream?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you are looking for open source modules suitable for consumers try <a href="http://www.buglabs.net/" rel="nofollow">http://www.buglabs.net/</a> However, it&#8217;s nowhere near cheap, and the hardware is not very open, since they have been going 2 years but are very reluctant to publish any hardware specs.</p>
<p>You also have to look at the business model, if the hardware can be easily manufactured cheaper by third parties, where is the revenue stream?</p>
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		<title>Comment on Open Hardware Production by Bob Cousins</title>
		<link>http://blog.folknology.com/2009/08/11/open-hardware-production/#comment-66</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob Cousins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Sep 2009 19:05:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.folknology.com/?p=65#comment-66</guid>
		<description>I think you have identified some of the key problems with OSH. Modular hardware is a great idea on paper, but all the hardware design factors work against it, i.e. size, power, cost etc. It might seem modularity increases flexibility, but it introduces design constraints which are more likely to limit the overall power. For example, if you choose a simple serial bus like I2C, it places a limit on bandwidth which may exclude many applications. Do you choose 3.3V or 5V? What is the power budget?

Also, just because a board is small and simple doesn&#039;t make it low cost. Low costs are achieved through mass production.

If the purpose was for education or rapid prototyping then the constraint of modular designs could be overlooked. But to create usable consumer products at low cost would be impossible.

As it happens I am working on an OSH project, called Lyre, a Digital Audio Player. It would certainly help to have some modules to snap together to at least create a prototype. 

What about PC/104? Is that not the standard for embedded computing?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you have identified some of the key problems with OSH. Modular hardware is a great idea on paper, but all the hardware design factors work against it, i.e. size, power, cost etc. It might seem modularity increases flexibility, but it introduces design constraints which are more likely to limit the overall power. For example, if you choose a simple serial bus like I2C, it places a limit on bandwidth which may exclude many applications. Do you choose 3.3V or 5V? What is the power budget?</p>
<p>Also, just because a board is small and simple doesn&#8217;t make it low cost. Low costs are achieved through mass production.</p>
<p>If the purpose was for education or rapid prototyping then the constraint of modular designs could be overlooked. But to create usable consumer products at low cost would be impossible.</p>
<p>As it happens I am working on an OSH project, called Lyre, a Digital Audio Player. It would certainly help to have some modules to snap together to at least create a prototype. </p>
<p>What about PC/104? Is that not the standard for embedded computing?</p>
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		<title>Comment on Open Hardware Production by Amino &#171; Folknology Labs</title>
		<link>http://blog.folknology.com/2009/08/11/open-hardware-production/#comment-63</link>
		<dc:creator>Amino &#171; Folknology Labs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Sep 2009 22:15:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.folknology.com/?p=65#comment-63</guid>
		<description>[...] of concepts that we are working on around opensource hardware production. As outlined in an earlier Folknology post, opensource hardware poses a number of obstacles compared to opensource software.We can help [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] of concepts that we are working on around opensource hardware production. As outlined in an earlier Folknology post, opensource hardware poses a number of obstacles compared to opensource software.We can help [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on Open Hardware Hacking by folknology</title>
		<link>http://blog.folknology.com/2009/03/20/open-hardware-hacking/#comment-51</link>
		<dc:creator>folknology</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Mar 2009 12:11:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.folknology.com/?p=53#comment-51</guid>
		<description>Wow that second link provides far to much to think about Phil, make my head explode. Serviceization is quite a cool take on the current emergent trends and the shadow concept is a great way of visualising value/responsibility and side effects.

Basically I think the digital genie has escaped from the bottle and is now leaking into reality..

Al</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow that second link provides far to much to think about Phil, make my head explode. Serviceization is quite a cool take on the current emergent trends and the shadow concept is a great way of visualising value/responsibility and side effects.</p>
<p>Basically I think the digital genie has escaped from the bottle and is now leaking into reality..</p>
<p>Al</p>
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		<title>Comment on Open Hardware Hacking by phil jones</title>
		<link>http://blog.folknology.com/2009/03/20/open-hardware-hacking/#comment-50</link>
		<dc:creator>phil jones</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Mar 2009 22:21:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.folknology.com/?p=53#comment-50</guid>
		<description>Couple of links worth reading :

http://www.orangecone.com/archives/2009/03/open_hardware_a.html

http://www.ugotrade.com/2009/03/18/dematerializing-the-world-shadows-subscriptions-and-things-as-services-talking-with-mike-kuniavsky-at-etech-2009/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Couple of links worth reading :</p>
<p><a href="http://www.orangecone.com/archives/2009/03/open_hardware_a.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.orangecone.com/archives/2009/03/open_hardware_a.html</a></p>
<p><a href="http://www.ugotrade.com/2009/03/18/dematerializing-the-world-shadows-subscriptions-and-things-as-services-talking-with-mike-kuniavsky-at-etech-2009/" rel="nofollow">http://www.ugotrade.com/2009/03/18/dematerializing-the-world-shadows-subscriptions-and-things-as-services-talking-with-mike-kuniavsky-at-etech-2009/</a></p>
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		<title>Comment on Reactored, my packet based future finally emerges by folknology</title>
		<link>http://blog.folknology.com/2008/05/31/reactored-my-packet-based-future-finally-emerges/#comment-48</link>
		<dc:creator>folknology</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Feb 2009 23:40:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://folknology.wordpress.com/?p=16#comment-48</guid>
		<description>Sure is Will, checkout my git submissions on github. 

If you have any questions about it, please feel free to email me or better still join Github (its free) and send messages there in context.

Thanks for dropping by

regards
Al</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sure is Will, checkout my git submissions on github. </p>
<p>If you have any questions about it, please feel free to email me or better still join Github (its free) and send messages there in context.</p>
<p>Thanks for dropping by</p>
<p>regards<br />
Al</p>
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